Darth Hater

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Choreographed Combat?

Generally when I read the word "Choreographed" I think dancing...

But what does choreographed combat mean? It means, well, dancing more or less. You step, I react, I step, you react Translates over to I swing, you collide, you swing, I collide. The joy of seeing lightsabers clash adds to immersion of the game, because well, it's iconic, and don't know how else to explain it. The epic lightsaber fights of people dodging, hitting, and then jumping over an opponent WHILE hitting, or along those lines, when you think epic Star Wars combat, right? Well, from what previous interviews said the combat will be choreographed, and if done correctly can prove to make a more epic "Immersion-festive" game if I say so myself. But I do have my questions (And will try like hell at PAX to get them answered)

korriban_interior_lightsaber_clash


Is the combat going to be like some previous MMOs where you do an ability and you cannot move until the ability is completed? Or until you hit "ESCAPE" to cancel the ability and are able to move again? Or will it be a rework on WoW where you move and the ability is canceled? I am more concerned about Jedi vs Sith combat, and how stand still it might be. How does one clash when moving? Doesn't make much sense. I could only see Jedi vs Sith clashing when both are standing still. But if you are by chance locked standing still, it opens up my next question.

SWTOR-Gameplay clashing


How would PvP work with choreographed combat? Jim the Jedi and Sado the Sith are fighting each other, locked in combat hoping to clash and dodge as many strikes as possible, then Sleeper the Bounty Hunter walks up and sees Jim fighting Sado. Am I then able to target and destroy Jim at ease knowing he is unable to move due to the fact he is in a stand still with Sado? What if ranged vs ranged happens? Is it locked in as well resulting in two more people standing still?

So my final question to our readers is, how do you, or how would you, like to see combat handled? Stand still? Mobility? Take into concideration the choreographed combat How do you think it will work?

Comments

  • TaboriHK's avatar
    • Posts: 0
    #10 TaboriHK Posted 8/17/2009 3:31:01 PM
    I see it working like WoW does, with a swing and separate ability cooldown. If you notice in WoW, the melee classes never really stop swinging unless their bar (rage, energy, runes) are on cooldown. I wouldn't be surprised to see something similar here. Or more specifically, it will probably be like the KOTOR turn-based system but played out in real time. You probably won't have the ability to pause but other than that I think it'll be pretty much the same.
  • DirectX's avatar
    • Posts: 0
    #8 DirectX Posted 8/15/2009 10:34:46 PM
    One thing I remember from an interview was something to this effect: Each move in combat will make sense. A Jedi can be in melee with his saber and then all of a sudden throw his saber back to deflect an incoming blaster bolt.

    So, if I'm remembering that quote accurately, a character will take a 'hit' every time his animations can't deflect/block an incoming attack.

    For example, if a blaster bolt is coming from the front and another from the back, then the Jedi will PHYSICALLY only be able to block one of those bolts.

    I like that system; it would mean you could overwhelm a Jedi with a horde of blaster fire.
    The fighting wouldn't rely only on luck, but instead how you position yourself and the situation your in.
  • nevi's avatar
    • Posts: 0
    #9 nevi Posted 8/16/2009 10:54:28 AM
    lets hope thats not the only way to kill a jedi..
    though i do like the idea of positioning being a predominant factor in combat. it would definitely make it more realistic - paying attention to your surroundings would become a huge factor in who walks away from a battle in one piece and who gets to do some traveling.
  • Sedit's avatar
    Jawa Trader
    • Posts: 130
    #7 Sedit Posted 8/15/2009 2:11:26 PM
    The one problem I see with choreographed combat is it might turn into rock-paper-scissors. Matrix Online had this kind of combat from what I am told and the winner turn out to be the one who won the rock-paper-scissors rolls the most. From what we have seen so far I don't think it will be rock-paper-scissors, but it could be some variant; however, I highly doubt it as it looks more like a tradition rpg style combat.

    It will look pretty that is for sure, but I hope it's really practical in that you don't need luck to win a fight, but rather some sort of skill.
  • smugglerfrtyto's avatar
    • Posts: 0
    #5 smugglerfrtyto Posted 8/15/2009 1:24:12 PM
    When you bring up the question of standstill combat, Wow has this down pat every single class must stand still to be really effective. In SWG the fights were more mobile with the ability to fire on the run and such. What I am hoping for is a combination of elements of the two styles, Jedi and Sith locked in lightsaber combat, but able to break off and avoid incoming fire at a moments notice. As to ranged fights, the smuggler class alone is based on mobility and speed, being able to find cover fast or use skill and luck to make it through a firefight by keeping in constant motion. Troopers on the other hand have a greater protection from heavy armor, but still need to able to move when neccessary. I think with the amount of work going into each class to make them unique, I believe this issue will be resolved and incorperated into each class to make them play like they are meant to be played. Jedi and Sith need the one on one combat that is iconic, but also the dextarity to leap back or over there opponent and either make an escape or engage more hostiles. One last note we must remember that lightsabers have the ability to reflect laser fire thus opening more avenues for consideration plus the duel sabers techniques that we have seen in the videos thus far released.
  • RogueJedi86's avatar
    Jawa Trader
    • Posts: 3118
    #4 RogueJedi86 Posted 8/15/2009 2:25:43 AM
    Maybe the whole system will work in real time so that it looks smooth. If it was very slow, they wouldn't need to make a new combat engine for it. My memory of KotOR has faded, but wasn't combat sorta synced in it?
  • DirectX's avatar
    • Posts: 0
    #1 DirectX Posted 8/14/2009 11:31:27 PM
    BioWare has already promised much in this category, but I feel they have not yet delivered. What we saw in the Documentary #3 video looked like a failed attempt at synchronized combat. I do however, think it will get much better before launch. The technology to pull this off is complex.

    Here is my opinion:

    Slow down the lightsaber fighting. Swinging fast doesn't mean a battle feels fast paced. It instead feels random, because there are very few humans with a reaction time that good. By slowing down the fighting, you not only give us the feel like we are reacting/parrying, but also you give the tech-side more time for CPU cycles, bandwidth, etc.
  • Sleeper's avatar
    Jawa Trader
    • Posts: 495
    #3 Sleeper Posted 8/15/2009 2:03:54 AM
    But by slowing it down, you need to increase hit damage, which could pose a problem with how other players speed is in comparison
  • Zoid's avatar
    Jawa Trader
    • Posts: 656
    #6 Zoid Posted 8/15/2009 1:34:21 PM
    There are two types of lightsaber combat, original trilogy and new trilogy. In the old movies, lightsabers looked like they weigh a ton and make for slow combat. The new movies are the opposite, where a sword made of ENERGY weighs almost nothing, making fast combat.
  • Zoid's avatar
    Jawa Trader
    • Posts: 656
    #2 Zoid Posted 8/15/2009 12:37:02 AM
    There is SOME choreographing going on in the fights, but it is hard to see. At least it isnt as random as lightsaber combat in Jedi Academy where you just pray you hit them.
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