Darth Hater

i don't know this feels rushed to me. they didn't give free to 15 a chance. Jeff Hickman came out and said that 40 % left because of the sub fee. i think the 40 % left because they didn't want to wait months for a content update and pay a sub fee.

and now they are saying content updates for every month and a half ? really? if they had done this before maybe the 40 % wouldn't have left in the first place!!!.

this feels rushed and on the same coin they didn't give this free to 15 a chance. all they needed to do was to put in some OVER TIME and get content patches out for the player base to chew on.

I agree... That 40% leaving for subs probably weren't broke, they probably just wanted more for their $15.  I would expect more regular, but smaller, releases.  If they all go in the cash shop, well that's just a bad idea that will take this game down a dark path.

Anybody that couldn't justify paying $15/month now won't be able to justify paying that much when the game goes F2P. Personally, I have no interest in vanity items or unlimited PVP and space combat. I like to focus on end game PVE. Can I justify paying $15/month for operations? If EA/Bioware wants my money, they need to lower the subscription price and substantially improve and add to the end game experience. Otherwise I'm out.

I feel you bro. The end game now needs to be allot more hardcore for it to be worth $15 a month.

I think that's part of the point of what they are doing.  If you only care about ops, maybe you do F2P and pay for a $3 or $5 a la carte purchase of ops access per month.  That beats $15 in your case for sure.  At least I think so.  Just a thought...

This sucks... I'm going to quit playing this game because of this. I refuse to play any game with a cash shop, no matter what they sell on it.

I want to play the game to earn things not pay to get stuff.

The model that they have suggested appears to be quite similar to that of Lord of the Rings Online, with some tweaks to it. If that's the case, I think this will be good for the game in the long run.

BioWare and EA face some more challenging things to tackle though, and the smoke and mirrors tactic in their statement is what worries me. They're not calling the spade a spade right now. I think what infuriates me just a little is the ignorance of Jeff Hickman in the announcement, claiming that "Since launch, we've been listening to feedback from our fans and adding new content and refining The Old Republic at a breakneck pace." - the highlighted part being partially true, but whilst they added Novare Coast, The Black Hole and Explosive Conflict, said content didn't really provide a massive amount of new stuff to do. The original size of Denova for example was cut down to a meager four bosses. 

I'm still a subscriber, and will probably remain one for a while yet, depending on the ability of BioWare to push out meaningful content. What the game does need, is some form of sandbox to keep people entertained beyond running the same daily quests over and over. The mistake of making the gear ladder for Hard Mode Flashpoints and Operations so easy to scale is one major issue the game needs to rethink and redo with any coming patches.

With that said, it's still a damned good game, despite the shortcomings. The journey up to level 50 is the most fun I've had in any MMO hands down, with some excellent story lines (and of course some less so). The key issue is the fact that the game went from full scale epic story line to a quite massive halt at 50. 

Add to it the lack of clear communication from BioWare on future expansion plans and there's fuel to the fire. At least some information or a state of the game address each month would be welcome. Frequent smaller content updates with slow paced content is what I personally prefer.

Free to Play isn't the end of the game, by far. What will be the breaking point is how fast they now can push out content to keep people playing, and ensuring that the subscribers feel they get their moneys worth from it. There's a few things they can do for that, and I think it's time to lift the veil on the Space Project and actually tell us what this is and what the plans are, and also give us guild capital ships and personal ship customization.  

As a player this whole F2P thing doesnt really affect me and my standing in TOR, im a big star was fan pre sequels, even enjoyed them somewhat. i'm an MMO gamer who doesn't mind shelling out $15 a month for a subscription, I did it for WoW for years, i did it for Rift and STO and more, and im a 6 months subscriber for TOR who just renewed, i'll only stop subbing to a game when i stop enjoying it and when i think the content isnt worth it, not because its got a F2P option. I think TOR's is ..just about worth it, and i'll keep subbing for 1.4 and makeb and all that stuff, so in the short term i'm going to be a subscriber.

What does worry me is the 6 months after Xmas, we know makeb and the dreadlords and HK has all been in the works for months so that content is fine, but after that, with the downsizing of the team and our new "cartel coins" i do fear for the content becoming "cash shop crap" shoved out every month and only having a sizeable update every 6 (like STO).

As for the F2P scheme they have put in, im interested to see what they come up with, If the cartel coins stuff is 2 things, Simply fluff and content packs for F2P players (i can see unlimited warzone packs $10(or their cartel coin equivilent), unlimited flashpoint packs $10 raid access $15, makeb $15 etc etc) then im good, if they start tho with items that are more powerful then subscribers can get in game, i'm done with the game. I wont support a P2win game.

In summary in the short term it doesnt affect me as a player, in the long term i have concerns as the direction of the content, but its just wait and see, my plan is to see out my 6 months that im comfortable with the content that will be delivered, after that i'll go month by month and cancel ASAP if it turns into a cash shop grab, P2win game. If it doesnt and they actually put out good content i'll stick with it.  if they go the content pack route to F2P players they'll haveto make content that subscribers will review as awesome or look good in trailers so maybe it wont adversely affect gameplay content.

Quote from aallya »

As for the F2P scheme they have put in, im interested to see what they come up with, If the cartel coins stuff is 2 things, Simply fluff and content packs for F2P players (i can see unlimited warzone packs $10(or their cartel coin equivilent), unlimited flashpoint packs $10 raid access $15, makeb $15 etc etc) then im good, if they start tho with items that are more powerful then subscribers can get in game, i'm done with the game. I wont support a P2win game.

I dont necessarily disagree with anything you said, in fact my thoughts are pretty much in line wiht yours - but with regards to the bolded:

Lets just say they bring out a new tier of PVE gear into the current game, campaignV2 with slightly increased stats. The only way to obtain that gear is by paying money for cartel coins. Most people would probably consider this P2Win, and im assuming you're no different - but what exactly are they winning? How does having that gear give them an advantage over other players if it makes no difference in content when you actually verse other players (PVP).

Secondly, would it still be an issue if for example in the current game nothing changed, except you could now purchase campaign gear via the cartel store OR by the normal way of earning it in game. Is that a problem?

However, if you were thinking more with regards to PVP gear (as imho, PVE gear makes no difference) - The way I see it is the current state of PVP is NOT balanced. Not even close. I can ding 50 with 7 other people who also just dinged 50, have never touched a single warzone while levelling, have absolutely pathetic gear, and get put against a group of 8 people who are 90 valor and fully augmented War Hero gear. Warzones are not the least bit balanced in SWTOR, so does it matter if that group of 8 people im versing with fully augmented War Hero gear got that by grinding for a couple of days/weeks, or by shelling out $20? Either way they have a massive advantage over me. If, however, I'm able to acquire that War Hero gear in the store (but not remove the ability for people to get it via traditional in-game methods) then I'm actually able to get my self up to where they are and level the playing field. Being able to buy PVP gear (as long as its also acquirable ingame) could very well potentially make warzones MORE balanced than they currently are.

The only real problem I have is if theres a new tier of PVP gear that can only be bought via money and is impossible to get in-game. That, in my opinion, would be a real deal-breaker.

Note: I personally would prefer no gear be available in the store whatsoever. I hope its just fluff, cosmetic stuff, etc. But I really dont think it would be that much of an issue as long as the exact same gear is also obtainable ingame in a reasonable amount of time.

The only real problem I have is if theres a new tier of PVP gear that can only be bought via money and is impossible to get in-game. That, in my opinion, would be a real deal-breaker.

Note: I personally would prefer no gear be available in the store whatsoever. I hope its just fluff, cosmetic stuff, etc. But I really dont think it would be that much of an issue as long as the exact same gear is also obtainable ingame in a reasonable amount of time.

This is pretty much what i meant,  higher powered gear available exclusively for cartel coins on the coin shop, . and yeah mainly for PVP but for PVE too, when i see the list of guilds who have done said content on the server who im competing against to clear stuf, i dont want it to be because they dug deep into daddies credit card and overpowered the content, instead of earning it.

competative raiding was one of the things i liked in WoW that TOR misses(due to the raids not really being up to scratch) if you have P2win gear for PVE you can kiss that goodbye.

As for gear in store, i just hope its custom looks stuff "qui gons robe" "lukes lightsaber hilt" stuff like that.

What I would pay for would be, for example, a way to get set bonuses onto Black Hole Armorings -- things that don't change gameplay but do allow customization.

My 2 cents: EA can rot in hell.

With the F2P only going to 50, I feel like it runs the danger of splitting the population.  There will the the (probably smaller) group of people who still pay for the endgame OPs and newest Warzones, and then there will be a group of people who just get to 50 on the F2P and run warzones,ops etc while never even trying to get past the level 50 cap staying F2P.

 Not sure if that is a good thing or a bad thing. 

I think the F2P move is justified for the obvious reasons - we'll have to wait and see how well it's implemented and just what it will be like, exactly - but overall it can be a good thing. This game brings up highly polarized reactions in most gamers - personally I like it, have been playing since beta, and will continue to play for the near future. If you think the game is crap then the F2P announcement should have little influence on you - you already dislike the game and have no reason to play it. For everyone else who hasn't tried it yet and are curious, or for those who liked it but couldn't afford/couldn't justify continuing to pay the sub fee, the F2P announcement could end up being just the thing to bring them in or bring them back.

The f2p transition was something we all expected .and I actually feel that it was ultimately the right direction to go in.

On the other hand....the way it was just dropped out of the blue (on most of us) came as quite a shock and just from a publicity / marketing standpoint i see it having a negative impact on the current player base and community, weather that will change in the future is to be seen.

The way that information is beeing rellayed to the comunity could really use some improvement (for example ...as someone who follows 3 swtor podcasts and checks up on DarthHater regularly i couldnt even in my wildest guess predict F2P coming this soon) ,and the fact that all the news in the past 3 months has been somewhat negative isnt helping

Im still sticking it out with this cuz i love bioware i love starwars and i love the old republic

thats my 2 cents atleast. // PEACE //