So I was sifting through all the smuggler update stuff and saw this in the gunslinger description...
"Master of the trick shot, the first to dive for cover and willing to take advantage of every opportunity, the Gunslinger and his dual blasters are the perfect team.
The Gunslinger can shoot out a man's legs to keep him from charging, blind him so he can't get to his weapons or inflict serious injuries for maximum distraction.
There's a right target for ending every disagreement and the Gunslinger knows them like the inside of his ship."
I separated out that middle sentence. Are they specifically targeting warriors with that "keeping him from charging" thing? Since we have an ability called force charge.
Quote from TwoHearted Are they specifically targeting warriors with that "keeping him from charging" thing? Since we have an ability called force charge.
I believe so. Taking into account that a Smuggler would have a considerable problem when facing a SW in melee combat, this ability will grant Smuggler characters the opportunity to keep a certain amount of space between them and their foe.
However, judging from the Gameplay media released so far, it takes the SW approximately 0,75s to leap towards his designated target. That being said, it requires the Smuggler to have a good reaction speed, additionaly, he would have to efficiently manage limitations due to his global cooldown. Last point however assumes that:<list type="ordered">the global cooldown will be greater than 0.75s, which I believe is very reasonable to expect.the ability won't be off the GCD.[/list]
Yup. You gotta give them something. A SW jumping at you would be pretty scary. Plus, lightsabers against blasters/kick to the nuts ability, sabers are winning that one. To keep all of the classes somewhat balanced, they have to have something to keep the distance.
Smuggler seems to be well suited to a CC role in PvP anyway. In can see finding these guys behind cover being a real pain for SW's being real Melee centered. It's interesting to consider how deep the PvP could get with the class structure as it is. I imagine an Agent providing cover fire / counter sniping for the SW's as the move across a battlefield, just has a real tactical sound to it.
Quote from TwoHearted The Gunslinger can shoot out a man's legs to keep him from charging, blind him so he can't get to his weapons or inflict serious injuries for maximum distraction.
Quote from TwoHearted I separated out that middle sentence. Are they specifically targeting warriors with that "keeping him from charging" thing? Since we have an ability called force charge.
I think you're focusing a little too much on the word "charge", considering how generic the term is in general conversation. Now, if they said something like "shooting the enemies hands, stopping him from channeling force lightning" I'd be a little more concerned, but "charge"? I use the word "charge" on an almost daily basis whenever I'm gallivanting around town and am crossing the street. About the only thing I got from reading that was "Hey, it's possible that Smugglers will get an immobilize or a slow (or both)". This is not shocking news to me.
The PAX demo really game me the impression that the Smuggler can be a very mobile class as well as stationary. There were alot of abilities that could be done on the run or out of cover so the damage is there. But the Smuggler is extremely squishy. I got my ass handing to me to by a battle droid, when I tried again behind cover I took only about 25% dmg.
I can easily see a smuggler getting ripped to threads by a Sith Warrior in the same way a Rogue can eat a Mage if he gets the surprise attack. So for the only way I see for smugglers to be viable against is to have CC(flash gernade, shots that stun, etc).
Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
Quote from Mako ....Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
I think that comment puts the hammer to nail on this topic... it really should be about the skill of the players. Ideally, both classes have their various methods for attacking or countering the attacks of the other, and the outcome is determined by variables in the environment (including luck) as well as each player's knowledge of his class and the class of his opponent and good, old-fashioned tactics.
Quote from Mako The PAX demo really game me the impression that the Smuggler can be a very mobile class as well as stationary. There were alot of abilities that could be done on the run or out of cover so the damage is there. But the Smuggler is extremely squishy. I got my ass handing to me to by a battle droid, when I tried again behind cover I took only about 25% dmg.
I can easily see a smuggler getting ripped to threads by a Sith Warrior in the same way a Rogue can eat a Mage if he gets the surprise attack. So for the only way I see for smugglers to be viable against is to have CC(flash gernade, shots that stun, etc).
Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
Yup, I agree. that's why I'll be hammering on people in PVP. Smugs and IA are the glass Cannons.
If anything, I would be thankful that we have the Bounty Hunter on our side. Those guys are being fit to be the next "Hunter class" when it comes to kiting melee damage dealers. Yes, the smuggler will be a buzzing fly in our face with their tricks of the trade, but there's also the trooper. They need to plant their feet on the ground to pull out the burst damage. Not good for someone going against a rabid wolverine of a Sith Warrior. At this juncture, I think the Jedi Knight will be having more problems closing in during PvP than a Sith Warrior.
Quote from Mako The PAX demo really game me the impression that the Smuggler can be a very mobile class as well as stationary. There were alot of abilities that could be done on the run or out of cover so the damage is there. But the Smuggler is extremely squishy. I got my ass handing to me to by a battle droid, when I tried again behind cover I took only about 25% dmg.
I can easily see a smuggler getting ripped to threads by a Sith Warrior in the same way a Rogue can eat a Mage if he gets the surprise attack. So for the only way I see for smugglers to be viable against is to have CC(flash gernade, shots that stun, etc).
Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
is force pull a Sith Warrior or Jedi Knight ability? I know force push is jedi knight.
Quote from Mako The PAX demo really game me the impression that the Smuggler can be a very mobile class as well as stationary. There were alot of abilities that could be done on the run or out of cover so the damage is there. But the Smuggler is extremely squishy. I got my ass handing to me to by a battle droid, when I tried again behind cover I took only about 25% dmg.
I can easily see a smuggler getting ripped to threads by a Sith Warrior in the same way a Rogue can eat a Mage if he gets the surprise attack. So for the only way I see for smugglers to be viable against is to have CC(flash gernade, shots that stun, etc).
Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
is force pull a Sith Warrior or Jedi Knight ability? I know force push is jedi knight.
Not sure that I have seen a "force pull" from anyone in the game, but Malgus did it in Hope. The warrior has been seen doing a saber strike with a "push" or knock back component during our class video. Not sure if that counts but it's an ability that throws people. =) We also get force lightning later in our leveling process. Throw choke in there and the SW is my kind of class =)
I am thinking our leap ability will be our main way to close the gap between opponents.. if sith warriors have more then that it would be nice but i am not giving my hopes up.
Smugglers have several Anti-Warrior/melee abilities. Depending on your AC (I think, can't remember right now), you get an AOE Stun, A single target stun, a slow, an AOE pushback.
That is not even counting the stealth options a Scoundrel could get. Not sure how well they work in PvP though.
In PVP matches when a Warrior would get up close to me, a swift kick to the tenders (when it was off cooldown) allowed me the breathing room to get away.
Scoundrels are for hit and run attacks while gunslingers are long range shooters and both should avoid melee vs melee fights. In most MMORPGs warriors are the ideal hunters and killers of rogue type classes. Rogues are ideal hunters and killers of healers and casters. Casters/hunters are ideal hunters and killers of warriors. This circular theme seems to be produced here in SWTOR so us rogues should try to avoid the extended melee vs melee fight with warrior classes of the same calibre and stick to our strengths rather than our weaknesses. Gunslingers are more a hunter type class and with the Smuggler you get a number of stun/slow type attacks so one should be able to keep warriors at a distance.
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Posted 9/29/2010 5:56:50 PMSo I was sifting through all the smuggler update stuff and saw this in the gunslinger description...
"Master of the trick shot, the first to dive for cover and willing to
take advantage of every opportunity, the Gunslinger and his dual
blasters are the perfect team.
The Gunslinger can shoot out a man's
legs to keep him from charging, blind him so he can't get to his weapons
or inflict serious injuries for maximum distraction.
There's a right target for ending every disagreement and the Gunslinger knows them like the inside of his ship."
I separated out that middle sentence. Are they specifically targeting warriors with that "keeping him from charging" thing? Since we have an ability called force charge.
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Posted 9/29/2010 8:08:31 PMI believe so. Taking into account that a Smuggler would have a considerable problem when facing a SW in melee combat, this ability will grant Smuggler characters the opportunity to keep a certain amount of space between them and their foe.
However, judging from the Gameplay media released so far, it takes the SW approximately 0,75s to leap towards his designated target. That being said, it requires the Smuggler to have a good reaction speed, additionaly, he would have to efficiently manage limitations due to his global cooldown.
Last point however assumes that:<list type="ordered">the global cooldown will be greater than 0.75s, which I believe is very reasonable to expect.the ability won't be off the GCD.[/list]
This being my first post: Hello DH community.
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Posted 10/6/2010 4:57:57 PMYup. You gotta give them something. A SW jumping at you would be pretty scary. Plus, lightsabers against blasters/kick to the nuts ability, sabers are winning that one. To keep all of the classes somewhat balanced, they have to have something to keep the distance.
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Posted 10/12/2010 5:19:16 AMSmuggler seems to be well suited to a CC role in PvP anyway. In can see finding these guys behind cover being a real pain for SW's being real Melee centered. It's interesting to consider how deep the PvP could get with the class structure as it is. I imagine an Agent providing cover fire / counter sniping for the SW's as the move across a battlefield, just has a real tactical sound to it.
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Posted 10/12/2010 10:42:32 AM- View User Profile
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Posted 10/12/2010 11:32:49 PMThe PAX demo really game me the impression that the Smuggler can be a very mobile class as well as stationary. There were alot of abilities that could be done on the run or out of cover so the damage is there. But the Smuggler is extremely squishy. I got my ass handing to me to by a battle droid, when I tried again behind cover I took only about 25% dmg.
I can easily see a smuggler getting ripped to threads by a Sith Warrior in the same way a Rogue can eat a Mage if he gets the surprise attack. So for the only way I see for smugglers to be viable against is to have CC(flash gernade, shots that stun, etc).
Think Mage vs Warrior in WoW, the Warrior is always charging trying to get close to drop the hurt while the Mage is being a dick popping frost nova then blinking away. But when that Warrior runs down the mage.... anyways I cannot wait to force pull a smuggler then force choke him for running away form me.
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Posted 10/13/2010 3:13:26 AMI think that comment puts the hammer to nail on this topic... it really should be about the skill of the players. Ideally, both classes have their various methods for attacking or countering the attacks of the other, and the outcome is determined by variables in the environment (including luck) as well as each player's knowledge of his class and the class of his opponent and good, old-fashioned tactics.
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Posted 10/14/2010 2:34:50 AMYup, I agree. that's why I'll be hammering on people in PVP. Smugs and IA are the glass Cannons.
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Posted 11/16/2010 4:58:58 AMIf anything, I would be thankful that we have the Bounty Hunter on our side. Those guys are being fit to be the next "Hunter class" when it comes to kiting melee damage dealers. Yes, the smuggler will be a buzzing fly in our face with their tricks of the trade, but there's also the trooper. They need to plant their feet on the ground to pull out the burst damage. Not good for someone going against a rabid wolverine of a Sith Warrior. At this juncture, I think the Jedi Knight will be having more problems closing in during PvP than a Sith Warrior.
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Posted 11/18/2010 10:51:51 PMis force pull a Sith Warrior or Jedi Knight ability? I know force push is jedi knight.
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Posted 11/19/2010 2:54:08 AMNot sure that I have seen a "force pull" from anyone in the game, but Malgus did it in Hope. The warrior has been seen doing a saber strike with a "push" or knock back component
during our class video. Not sure if that counts but it's an ability that throws people. =) We also get force lightning later in our leveling process. Throw choke in there and the SW is my kind of class =)
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Posted 11/19/2010 8:10:35 AMThe only class with a confirmed Force Pull is the Consular, though it's such a universal ability I wouldn't be surprised to see it show up elsewhere.
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Posted 11/19/2010 2:45:15 PMI am thinking our leap ability will be our main way to close the gap between opponents.. if sith warriors have more then that it would be nice but i am not giving my hopes up.
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Posted 12/10/2011 2:39:08 PMSmugglers have several Anti-Warrior/melee abilities. Depending on your AC (I think, can't remember right now), you get an AOE Stun, A single target stun, a slow, an AOE pushback.
That is not even counting the stealth options a Scoundrel could get. Not sure how well they work in PvP though.
In PVP matches when a Warrior would get up close to me, a swift kick to the tenders (when it was off cooldown) allowed me the breathing room to get away.
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Posted 12/10/2011 7:37:03 PMScoundrels are for hit and run attacks while gunslingers are long range shooters and both should avoid melee vs melee fights. In most MMORPGs warriors are the ideal hunters and killers of rogue type classes. Rogues are ideal hunters and killers of healers and casters. Casters/hunters are ideal hunters and killers of warriors. This circular theme seems to be produced here in SWTOR so us rogues should try to avoid the extended melee vs melee fight with warrior classes of the same calibre and stick to our strengths rather than our weaknesses. Gunslingers are more a hunter type class and with the Smuggler you get a number of stun/slow type attacks so one should be able to keep warriors at a distance.