Darth Hater

Hey all,
Runo here with Sicarius of Lord Adraas' levelling build!

I'm currently in the process of constructing a guide to building an efficient high-DPS PvE/PvP tank that is capable of not only dishing out the damage he or she deals, but taking it. In my opinion, burning down mobs more quickly saves you HP -- Vette can supplement additional DPS to burn down non-elites faster and Quinn can heal you up to help make up for the lack of added "crunch" from the Immortal spec. You won't really need any more threat building abilities or added defense until your 40s -- I've gotten from 1-35 so far just soloing with Vette or taking on Heroic 2s with Quinn, and have main tanked every flashpoint between 1-35 without Immortal. Below is my work in progress guide to developing a powerful non-Immortal spec Juggernaut tank.

[b]DPS Logs[/b]
Here is my "DPS Meter" (screenshots of high damage hits coming soon) 'log'. Hopefully they add a combat log or something so it's easier to verify these, but for now you'll have to bear with me as I update the guide. All of these were tested at Level 34 against even-con Standard human mobs in PvE. PvP totals coming soon.

[Ability Name - Approximate or Exact Highest CRITICAL Hit so far] (Tested without any Sunder Armor stacks applied for record's sake)
Vicious Slash ~855
Ravage ~2800+
Smash ~1500
Force Scream ~1000
Pommel Strike ~1700
Savage Kick ~1400

[b]Levelling Progression[/b]
Between 1-24, you should start by picking up talents to train into the Immortal tree to start with. Smash hits like a truck as you start to fill out its respective talents from Rage, but it becomes what's practically an area nuke once you're high enough to put points into its talents in the Vengeance tree. Click the text below to access each spec!

[url=http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/juggernaut/#::f43efe2fef2defefef2e]Here is what your build should look at by 25-26.[/url]

[url=http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/juggernaut/#::ef2ef8ef2ef27efe2fef2defefef2e]And by 35, your build should be heading in this direction. This is my CURRENT LIVE BUILD.[/url]

[url=http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/sith_warrior/juggernaut/#::e6f4efedfe2f2ef23efe2def2defefef2e:]By 42+ you have enough talents to fill out a pretty mean Immortal build, which are actually the best PvE tanks, remaining nearly unrivaled in PvP. Just in case that's not your thing, here's a 50 Rage/Veng build for reference.[/url]

[b]Attack Chain and Stances by 35[/b]
You can use this attack chain or some mixture or variant thereof to maximize damage dealt and spend and build Rage efficiently. I can guarantee that your target will be hurting or dead by the time you finish this attack chain.
[Soresu Form, Unnatural Might and Sprint should be running AT ALL TIMES, though you may choose to swap to Shien Form for additional DPS when off-tanking or in PvP.]
Activate Enrage
Open with Force Leap (where applicable)
Savage Kick->
[Threatening Scream (in PvP ONLY)]
Sunder Armor->
Ravage->
Vicious Slash->
Force Choke->
Sunder Armor->
Smash->
Force Scream->
Pommel Strike->
Force Push->
Force Leap->
Sunder Armor->
->etc.

[b]Tips and Tricks[/b]
Some of these may be obvious; others, maybe not so much!
*Open with Force Leap (and Savage Kick if available) into Sunder Armor.
*Chilling Scream and Force Leap let you activate Savage Kick instantly after your GCD ends.
*Obliterate should be saved as a mini-Force Leap, letting you close the distance between yourself and higher or distant targets.
*Chilling Scream slows Huttball carriers down even further.
*Taunt and Threatening Scream can be used to reduce damage on friendly targets in PvP. Use it when you can to stop targets from dealing burst or spike damage on soft friendlies in player combat.
*Guard is important. Guard local area healers and Huttball carriers.

[b]Itemization[/b]
[COMING SOON]

All in all, I ask that you bear with me as I update the guide and post any feedback or suggestions here, please!

what kind of gear are you looking to get, dps or tank?

Looking good Runo, Keep it coming...

My eyes T-T !

I will try your build and see how it goes, but please do something to clean up this post.

You will get more reponses if it is an easier read.

Hi... I'm going to try this too, but you keep talking about putting points into Immortal, yet you don't have any points in Immortal with your spec links.

lvl 25 im gonna try this Ill let you guys know how it goes.

   -Vok Ro-Dah-

A few points I'd like to make as an experienced Juggernaut who plays both a Tank and DPS in normal and hard mode operations and both in PvP.

1. The above proposed build is completely useless in an operation if you plan on being a tank. The mobs will eat you alive and your healer will rage quit. You won't have the mitigations you need without full immortal spec and appropriate tanking gear.

2. DPS wise a full vengeance spec will outperform a mixed vengence/rage build in PVE. In PvP i have used a mixed vengeance/rage spec, a pure vengeance spec, and a pure rage spec. Keep in mind when I say 'pure' spec, i mean the majority of my talent points are in that skill tree with as many as 10 points spread to obvious talents in other trees. I can do top dps in Rage/Vengeance if i go vengeance all the way to impale, and rage all the way to obliterate. However, overall a pure Rage build tends to be more mobile, more flexible, and more survivable as a dps stance in PvP. Full immortal spec is CC heavan and will infuriate other players to no end much like operative cc does; it also is great for ball carrying or protecting a ball carrier in huttball.

3. The rotation you recommend is only applicable to regular and strong mobs. Pommel strike and savage kick are useless against bosses in flashpoints and operations. Also, an untalented (meaning you have to channel it) Force Choke is a DPS loss and waste of rage, unless EVERYTHING is on cooldown, in most stances unless you are needing to interupt a mob that /can/ be interupted with force choke, or you are in PvP and interuptting the other player is necessary even though it will make you immobile for 3 seconds.  And quite frankly if you have your rotation down this will almost never be the case. As a full immortal spec tank, force choke is a great way to keep dps up since you can hit a mob with it as if its just a bleed and use other skills without it being interuptted.

I appreciate the advice, but the reason I haven't updated the guide (if you check the date of the OP) is because it's pretty obselete now, as you noticed with your points. I too am an experienced Jug and I've completed every Hard Mode as a DPS or Tank and feel I do fairly well in PvP, as well.

I just did a respec to try this at level 17 and it is saving me so much time. Im able to run through people a couple levels higher than me now. Im only and 18 as of now but doing level 18-20 missions just me and vette